Shame on you Design Continuum....Shame on you!

Taking credit for another design firms work is wrong. But to do it on national TV (NBC Today show this past week) is STUPID. We all know the industrial design community is small and well connected. Did you think nobody would notice this. You made a very irresponsible and foolish move in my book!
Joss Design designed the Swiffer (and I say designed very loosely here, because this type of product already existed in Japan, and that’s another story I wont get into right now). How do I know? Because I worked on the Swiffer at Joss design back in '97-'99. Joss design even won a IDEA SILVER for the Swiffer in 2000.

http://new.idsa.org/idea/idea2000/consumer.htm

Shame on you!!!

What do you expect? Stealing is ok and most everyone here is doing it. So what?

if you are vorrect,
is suggest showing the proof to the press, and asking DC to simply make a correction on thier part-

It is my impression that the “Swiffer” and any other U.S. versions similar are nearly exact replications of products that already existed in Asia. Can anyone really claim this as theirs?

Very true Guest 1… Just so everybody knows, I’m not trying to take credit, nor do I want to. (I personally don’t think Joss should either)… The point I wanted to make was, I think taking credit for other peoples work on national TV is dumb.

As for “What do you expect? Stealing is ok and most everyone here is doing it. So what?”

Stealing is NOT ok… It makes you look ignorant. Can’t you come up with your own ideas. And No… not everyone is doing it. There is a BIG difference between getting inspiration, thoughts and ideas from someone else’s work and blatantly ripping it off. I hope you know this.

Thanks for bringing this up…

I wondered about that when I saw it on TV as well. I also thought Joss was the lead on Swiffer, so thanks for the reminder about the IDEA award. Is there any explanation behind this? An old principal at Joss that works at DC now? Prelim development at DC? Later iterations at DC?

After seeing the piece on the Today show, one would think DC did it all themselves…

http://dcontinuum.com/content/portfolio.php?sub=1&id=89

Nate, Your right, after watching the show and the case study on DC’s web site, you would think that DC invented the Swiffer from scratch.

As far as I know, no one from Joss is working at DC.

The development of the original Swiffer (Excluding the Asian products) was done at Joss. The original Swiffer came out with “screw in” handle sections and of course the electrostatic pad for attracting dust. The Swiffer out today is the same design but the handle sections snap together. A slight change in an engineering detail. Now DC may have done this detail change but it’s not enough to say you designed it from the beginning.

FYI: The Preliminary development for the Swiffer “WetJet” was also done at Joss… But I believe DC finished that. (Concept 6)… :slight_smile:

Nate, Your right, after watching the show and the case study on DC’s web site, you would think that DC invented the Swiffer from scratch.

As far as I know, no one from Joss is working at DC.

The development of the original Swiffer (Excluding the Asian products) was done at Joss. The original Swiffer came out with “screw in” handle sections and of course the electrostatic pad for attracting dust. The Swiffer out today is the same design but the handle sections snap together. A slight change in an engineering detail. Now DC may have done this detail change but it’s not enough to say you designed it from the beginning.

FYI: The Preliminary development for the Swiffer “WetJet” was also done at Joss… But I believe DC finished that. (Concept 6)… :slight_smile:

Here is another rip off example from DC

I can not believe that the people at DC are so s****d!

they claim to have designed this Siemens phone:

http://dcontinuum.com/content/portfolio.php?sub=3&id=243

BUT it was designed by designafairs:

http://www.designafairs.com/index-flash.php?language=de&menu=101&sub=338

the designworld is very small, they really should now that.

didnt see the show. but the site doesnt claim what people say it does afaic.

Procter and Gamble has always known how to clean, but came to Continuum to collaborate on the invention of a totally new technology for cleaning. The resulting Swiffer and Swiffer WetJet have been among the most successful and profitable new products in the P&G stable

doesnt say they designed the Swiffer. only that they helped with the core technology. and did some concepts that may have gotten dumped.

Continuum attacked the problem scientifically and from the user’s perspective. Working with P&G’s technical staff, Continuum engineers created a clever testing apparatus that would allow the team to try numerous old and new methods for cleaning a floor. Rapid iteration of ideas uncovered a unique opportunity to improve cleaning by “entraining” dirt in either a mop or a broom or something else that was neither.

mostly engineering assist it seems.

P&G then took the project in-house, refining the entrainment technology.

then may have farmed out the ID to Joss. who maybe did more engineering.

The first product launched, the Swiffer, generated the strongest test market results in P&G’s history of marketing cleaning products.

again. no claim they did the ID.

anyone have a link to the show? what did DC really say? i see alot of people misreading stuff.

heehee, come on let’s get DC to show the skeches, I bet someone at Joss has the same sketch with an earlier date…

bad bad DC, so naughty.

Design Continuum is a well known and highly regarded firm. With so much intrinsic success to leverage, it begs the question:

“Why?”

To me this begs the question “where is our industry oversight?”
How do we define a claim of work? If a firm were to falsly claim another’s work what are the industry reprecurssions? Where is our ethical guidelines and who is our industry ombusdman?
Lawyers, reporters, fine artists, and architects all have professional societies that actively manage these issues. Why can’t we?

Link to the show:

http://www.dcontinuum.com/_qt/DCONTODAY_LORES.mov

Now tell me that this does not sound like they didn’t come up with the whole idea. Yes the do not actually use the words “we designed it”, But With quotes like:

" P&G came to us and said they needed to find a new innovative ways to clean floors" - DC
“And you came up with the Swiffer” - NBC Reporter
“We said why not use static electricity to attract the dirt and put it on the end of a stick and make a disposable…” -DC
and my favorite…“And the Swiffer was born!” - DC
“Its the company’s most successful idea so far” - NBC Reporter

Come on!!!

By the way: The use of static electricity to help pick up the dust was known by the Joss team and if my memory serves me correctly, P&G were the ones who owned the IP to the electrostatic sheet technology. Now lets not forget the stick, pad and disposable were already part of an existing product line in Asia… Just a design patent in the way!!!

From reading what DC claimes in their lengthy write up, is the case of one design firm doing the research, or a new product idea coming out of another product program, the the client internalizing it for a year or two; then desciding to go outside with which ever firm they are using at the time.

I have actually seen this happen quite often when dealing with P&G and many other large caliber clients. Other firms have own a half dozen or so awards by finalizing designs that I recomended and even concepted while doing doing research programs. It is all just part of the design industry world when dealing with large clients who are working with multiple big name firms at once.

Yes, after working with DC engineering and research team to develop and test the technology. Like I said this is usually the case with this size client. One ID firm will work on the Initial Technology research/Bainstorming, another on the Ergo, onther on the design development, and yet another on the final design for manufacturing. Cas in Point Astro does a lot of HP design, Gecko does a lot of HP design engineering, both have rights to say they worked on the same product. They just have to be specific as to what their roles were.

Same goes for team members in their portfolios!

Read thought the details, as well as watched the Today Show video. Not once does DC claim they designed it, only suggested the idea. “Why not use static electricity…makes it a disposable…and put it on a stick.” Quote direct from the video. Also from quick patent search, since all 15 patents related to the swiffer only contain one individuals name, who I believe is a program director leads me to definitely agree with the claim that they suggested the idea prior to 92 as this is when the first patent is dated and P&G later took it to Jost. But never patented or protected the design or idea of the “Mop” only the technology in the pad itself.

And seriously if DC was making false claims P&G would never let them use their name on the air, or on their website. National PR like that you better get client approval to use their name well in advance! Or risk a lawsuit for using a trademarked name for promotional reasons without prior consent. This is the whole reason you get written releases from clients on all marketing materials referencing work you performed for them, including allowing their PR people to approve the text, and imagery.

damn people

the media wants a story, they look at:
-what’s on the table the viewer can relate to
-what was very succesful
-etc.

ContinUum worked on the Swiffer, so they have it on display
Media sees swiffer, hey tell us about the Swiffer.

ContinUum takes credit for the work they did, don’t go into detail
(which media would have edited out anyway as it doesn’t help their story)
that’s just how these things work, the media likes a hero, or a villain
-especially in quick hit pieces like this

obviously DC had some part in the development, give them some credit, they had some contribution or P&G folks would be suing in a hurry (as mentioned above)

seriously lighten up, Joss knows what they contributed, and it’s documented, and they have the IDEA award

watched video. i didn’t hear them say they designed this. what the reporter says is out of their control. has happened to me on products. more closely you read/listen the more you realize how poorly journalists report the facts.

What’s presented by the media may very well not reflect what the interviewee meant. The media always edit and present the contents in a way that will benefit their rating, which is to spice things up. They will make the story juicer by saying one particular party did something to get the audience excited, because afterall, Americans are all for heroism.

Did Spiderman save the city all by himself? What about the spider that bit him? What about the scientists who bred the spider? What about the fund providers of the project?

Then who do we remember? The hero whom the media chooses to showcase.