Nest Thermostat 2.0

Just got an email there is a new Nest 2.0 thermostat out. 20% thinner and one pc. stainless bezel.

Looks sweet. Just ordered one (they didn’t ship to Canada previously, but seem to do so now) on a whim.

Anyone actually see this thing in person and use it?

R

Hello
I am not sure if you meant if I have used the old one or the new one you are showing. I have used the old on it was very nice and simple. I saw it at random at a distant family members house and turned it and just sort of played around with it. The turn was very smooth with just a little friction very nice. Felt like a quality piece of equipment.

Whoa, those are really available? I thought the previous gen was just a concept. Guess I wasn’t paying attention.

Totally available. Get in before in lawsuit:)

R

Glad to see they’ve made it compatible with more complex ventilation systems. They are way out ahead. Love the detail on the wiring block too.

Ive been eyeing the nest, but really find it hard to justify the cost. My $30 normal digital one has somehow gotten a mind of its own and will change the temp at a random time that it isnt set for, so Im looking for a replacement. I just dont know if the extra $200 will really pay itself off. The wife will look at it as just another object I bought because it was cool when I could have gotten one for a quarter the cost…

aesthetics/materials aside, what made you decide on this vs a standard $50 one? (im just looking for a valid argument to use aside from ‘look at it’)

It’s not worth it. That’s not the point. Current one I have is programmable, and I’m in a loft so don’t pay my heating bills separately, but this is cool. You can control it via iPhone!

All kidding aside, my current one supposedly works, but I have no idea how or if it actually does.

R

If you want an easy user interface, the ability to adjust temp at a distance, the Nest is half the price of anything else on the market.

Having said that, any digital thermostat is just as precise (ignore all marketing BS about this).

I honestly just can’t figure out how my system works. It’s digital. I can program wake/leave/day/return/night temperatures into it at both a max and min. That would all make sense (cool if above max, heat if above min), but then there is another digital option for heat/cool/off and fan/auto/circ. Have no idea what the fan settings do.

So if I have it set to cool, AFAIK, it won’t heat if the temperature is below the minimum and vice versa if set to heat, which confuses me.

I haven’t read the full manual, but figure it should make some sense. It doesn’t.

And it’s beige. And ugly. Touchscreen, but green backlit monochrome.

R

My basic Honeywell went belly up a few months ago and I was seriously considering the Nest thermostat. Until I read a “what if” scenario where you lose the network backbone that issues updates and controls the unit. Or what happens if the company goes out of business and there are no more updates or central servers?

Maybe these questions have been addressed more recently. It was enough to push me towards a slightly better Honeywell, for now.

I have met Fred Bould (at Bould Design) once or twice and he’s a great guy. Tall too.

Is the control not local? Didn’t know it relies on network to function. I didn’t read about closely but would guess the network on provides support and web function, not primary functionality, but could be wrong.

R

Slippy: I wouldn’t worry about Nest disappearing. They are well financed and selling very well. Great profit margin too.

Richard: This what you got? It is nasty. It was state of the art about 8 years ago. Now, every Chinese factory makes one.

The Nest will work without a network. You can actually program it through a display on the unit, but it’s a pain to do so. The only downside is no updates, but they’ve been on the market for awhile now…I’m pretty sure they have it figured out.

Another thing: pull that honeywell off the wall (don’t worry, it’s 24V only). Make sure the new Nest has all the necessary connections. It sounds like you might have a complex system. It might even be worth it to hire a contractor. It shouldn’t be that much…the install takes 15 minutes.

That’s exactly it. I did pull it off and checked the wires before I ordered. Apparently ok for nest.

R

Regarding the fan settings, it’s actually a nice control if it operates the way mine do (I put in the Home Depot house-brand ‘RiteTemp’ flat panel touch digitals a few years ago, they sink into the wall and only light up when you touch them, but they’re no piece of art for sure) - ‘fan’ means your condenser fan will just keep running, even if the temperature doesn’t demand it (good for introducing airflow into an otherwise stale environment but you’ll notice your outdoor unit running and running and running). ‘auto’ is the default setting and operates in tandem with the heat/cool settings - only using the condenser and blower fan as and when needed. ‘circ’ uses the air returns by turning on the blower fan but doesn’t turn on the condenser, so it only circulates interior air.

The two forced air HVAC systems in my house are boring and inefficient but not hard to wire, they do at least have attached, automatic humidifiers to eliminate dry air and UV light boxes in the blower path to kill airborne bacteria before they enter the living space, so that’s kinda cool! Our last house had an oil fed boiler with HWBB heat but no AC, so I installed SpacePak in the attic, a neat AC system that uses high velocity air, circular soft-ducts with small ceiling mounted outlets that you place in the corners of rooms - it was a very neat system and is meant to be unobtrusive - looked like a big octopus in the attic! We have a condo that uses a natural gas fed hot water heater that supplies the otherwise normal ducted condenser / blower AC system with a heating element to act like a boiler when heat is called for (blower passes air over the hot pipe array). Funky.

So all the algorithms and computations are done inside the nest, and not outsourced to a cloud computer? Non-local would be a deal breaker for me. However, one of my other concerns is with auto away. Do they use IR to sense people home? Im guessing it would pick up my (currently) 110 lb dane puppy, and assume someone is always home. Dont call PETA, but my dog can deal with it being a little colder/warmer than the normal 68 when we are home. That would pretty much defeat the purpose of it for me.

They use IR to detect movement. This function can be turned off.

BTW: I designed thermostats for 5 years. They are crap for a reason. All these companies are either run by engineers or construction workers. Their heads explode if you actually try to do good design.

I was one of the early adopters of the original Nest and the Auto-Away works well even if you have a dog. I have a 75 pound dog who barks at anything and the Auto-Away doesn’t mistake him for a person.
I only had one issue with it and that is the screen developed a red line on it. I took a picture of it, sent it to Nest, and with their 5 year warranty (I know!!), they replaced it. Easy as it gets.
As far as the money goes, it is expensive and they are making good profits on it, but I didn’t buy it as a sound financial choice, I bought because it will help me reduce my energy use. I don’t get out enough to hug trees, so this is a way I try to do something to keep the world spinning.

I know I’ve mentioned this in previous threads:
Today’s ultra-high efficiency heating systems work best when the fan runs constantly (they are variable speed…) and the thermostat is set at 1 temperature. Dropping the temp and raising the temp by 5 degrees means the system has to work very hard to cool off the house, and you end up with uneven temperatures. When I got my system installed 2 years ago, the tech just told me to get any basic digital thermostat, set the temp, set the fan to ON and let it go. He said programmable thermostats only work their best if you have a system that doesn’t have multi-speed fans and multi-stage heating elements.

I know the Nest will work with these systems, but I don’t believe that it will save you money any more or less than a standard programmable thermostat.

NURB: Biggest single thing you can do to save money: INSULATION. It’s also the least sexy thing that no one ever asks. People always mentions a new AC or furnace when selling a home, rarely do they talk about blowing insulation places.

A thermostat might save a few bucks, but it will take many years to recoup $200-300. I would buy it more for the features and looks than money saving.

I’m interested to see how the thing really works. It’s actually not that clear on the website. From what I gather, you fiddle with it for a week up and down, then it learns your preferences. Seems a little too magical, though maybe it works. Don’t really get the auto away thing either. For me, for example, I work at home, so am home all day, so will it know that, or do I keep needing to walk by the thing?

As mentioned, my current one I know how to program, I just can’t figure out what the heat/cool and fan things do. This seems at least simpler in that way.

Really though, I bought it because it looks cool. Not expecting or would even know about any savings as don’t ever see a bill.

R