IDSA still requires NASAD for recommending schools

There has been some discussion about the applicability of a school being NASAD accredited. Specifically, someone (TaylorWeldon) noted that IDSA dropped the NASAD requirement for recommending schools for Industrial Design.

This is NOT true. I spoke with Leslie Cron at IDSA who noted that ALL recommended schools must be NASAD approved. They will, however, allow student chapters at non- NASAD accredited schools.

Here is what IDSA states on their web site:

Listing of Industrial Design School Programs
“NASAD accreditation is required for a program to be listed by IDSA on its Web site and other media of its choosing”

I am posting this to clear up this confusion and to correct some bogus information posted on this site. I am sure some will say that NASAD accreditation is irrelevent,but this is not the case as far as IDSA is concerned.

We’re both only half right.

“According to the IDSA’s 2006 bylaws proposal, the changes were enacted because students were being held to a double standard. Unlike the previous student requirement, professional members are not required to be graduates of NASAD- accredited institutions. The change does not signal a break in the relationship between IDSA and NASAD, in which IDSA consults with NASAD regarding accreditation criteria.”

So the IDSA / NASAD issue is cleared up.

They’re still a joined entity that consults with eachother regarding accreditation for schools.
However, they don’t require individuals to be from a NASAD accredited institution to be recognized as IDSA members or equally valuable practicing professionals of Industrial Design.

Essentially- you have no benefit with a NASAD accreditation once out of school. All graduates and professionals are in the exact same position as far as IDSA is concerned, regardless of the accreditation.

it’s a golden sticker, at best

Also-


SCAD (not accredited by NASAD) just hosted the IDSA Regional Conference this past March of 2008.


If NASAD has such a sway on IDSA’s decisions (hint: they don’t), the IDSA regional conference wouldn’t be taking place at a non-accredited institution.


I’m done with this. The only way NASAD has affected anyone in the ID world is by reading this long boring set of threads on C77, otherwise nothing, a non issue.

How long is this going to go on? This has been discussed tons of times on Core77 and it has always come to the same conclusion and that is no one agrees. Why don’t you email IDSA and ask them.

My point of view is that regardless of some accreditation I still got a great education and personally feel that I am very good at what I do.

Taxguy I do have to say that I am a little insulted as I feel that you are telling Taylor and I we received a mediocre education and this is not true. I don’t feel you can judge the program until you have been to an accredited program and a no accredited program and you will see that it does not matter.

To add to Taylors Point, the souther district VP is a former SCAD Prof as well. So why would she have neen elected (while she was at SCAD) if this was such a big deal?

One more thing…Taxguy you said you are not a designer correct? What do you do and why do you care so much about this?

Package ID states:Taxguy I do have to say that I am a little insult as I feel that you are telling Taylor and I we received a mediocre education and this is not true. I don’t feel you can judge the program until you have been to an accredited program and a no accredited program and you will see that it does not matter.

Response: I am NOT saying that schools like SCAD are bad or good. I just wanted to respond to bogus information. Taylorwelden can give any opinion that he wishes. In fact, his opinions on NASAD being irrelevant to job offers ( as is your opinion)may be quite correct. I just can’t abide by someone giving an opinion and using bogus facts or outright lies to justify his position. I felt this needed clarification,which I did.

You might ask, “Who cares.” The answer is prospective future students of design and their parents. At least they can make an informed decision.

OH yes, one other group cares: those that prefer the truth!

Well here is the answer that everyone else that has been reading this long drawn out question is thinking…WHO CARES!!!

Like it or not, it is an issue for some people. The question is, why haven’t they gotten the accreditation? Tat way it wouldn’t be an issue. Anybody have any insight to that? Maybe there is a very good reason.

The question is, why haven’t they gotten the accreditation? That way it wouldn’t be an issue. Anybody have any insight to that? Maybe there is a very good reason.

SCAD did look into NASAD accreditation. NASAD allows public universities to get accreditation for just one school/department within the University. For private schools (SCAD is a private school) they require the entire school to get NASAD accreditation. There were other schools within SCAD that did not want to do this so the Industrial Design Department was unable.

As you may or may not know- SCAD has 38 different programs of study, they’re organized into 7 different ‘schools’, each school and/or program exists independently from the others in a sense. For example, the Painting department is roughly 40 blocks away from the Industrial Design department.

Getting Industrial Design to share the same rules as Painting, Architecture, Broadcast Design, Advertising Design, Graphic Design, Writing, Fibers, Sound Design, Sculpture, Visual Effects, Film and Television, (and all the rest) would seem to be quite difficult.

So the final word is, as a private school, NASAD requires the entire school to follow it’s criteria.
38 programs following NASAD’s requirements is insane/extremely difficult/expensive/time-consuming/requiring major changes/useless.

This was a pot from Jkolko a few months back that explains the whole issue.

Hi,

I can try to shed some light on it, but I’m certainly no expert; people get doctorate degrees in this sort of thing and go on to be executives in higher education administration (and that certainly isn’t me!). Official disclaimer: the following post is my own thoughts and ideas, and doesn’t necessarily represent my employer’s thoughts or ideas.

Quote:
What is the difference between these regional accrediting bodies, and the national, but art school only NASAD? How recent was the SACS accreditation? And can you reiterate the newer IDSA policy and accreditation of the program?


SACS, or the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools, accredits 11 states in the US. Each region has a regional accrediting body; while they seem to be private institutions, they also have a government side - perhaps we can think of them like the Post Office?

You can read the SACS principles of Accreditation here: http://www.sacscoc.org/principles.asp

You can view a list of the schools accredited by SACS here:
http://www.sacscoc.org/schoolresults.asp

While I may certainly be incorrect, I think there are rules and regulations connecting Federal financial aid and accreditation status; that is, students can’t get loans or other government assistance when attending a non-accredited entity. Thus, regional accreditation is critical for an institute of higher education that costs any substantial amount of money.

NASAD, or National Association of Schools of Art and Design, accredits schools of art and design. This accreditation is IN ADDITION to the regional accreditation. I’m still scratching my head trying to determine just what, exactly, one gets from going through a secondary national accreditation process.

You can read the NASAD principles of Accreditation here: http://nasad.arts-accredit.org/site/docs/NASAD%20Handbook%202003-2004%20PDF/NASAD%20HANDBOOK%202005-2006.pdf

You can view a list of the schools accredited by NASAD here:
http://nasad.arts-accredit.org/index.jsp?page=Member+Lists


The way I understand this, any accreditation visit by any entity (NASAD, SACS, FIDER, etc) is a complete pain for the institution. Essentially, the accrediting body is free to puruse and poke at any and every piece of data the school has regarding education; this includes past curriculum data, grades, schedules, facilities, hiring and firing practices, and maybe even salaries. Clearly, this is sensitive information for any institution, so a visit by the accreditation body is not to be taken lightly. Accreditation costs money, and takes a great deal of time and paperwork to prepare for.


IDSA doesn’t accredit programs. However, they wanted to have a baseline for recommending programs, so that Joe’s Bargain Product Design Packing Factory doesn’t get listed alongside RISD. They picked NASAD a few years back, and quickly realized that this doesn’t make a great deal of sense - there are a number of schools that don’t have NASAD accreditation but went through the rigorous process of regional accreditation. Recently - at the last IDSA conference - they announced that they had changed their rules and NASAD accreditation was no longer required.


FWIW, SCAD has held SACS accreditation since approximately 1980; while http://www.sacscoc.org/dtails.asp?instid=61680 lists the most recent reaffirmation, the school was originally a candidate in 1980 and the wayback machine shows this information here:
Results

Related reading: Design Certification - by Carroll Gantz, FIDSA

And also FWIW, I happen to agree with most of what you yourself have said on several occasions in the past: it makes little difference about who you went to school with, where you went to school, how famous the school is, or what sort of accreditation your school holds. What matters the most is your portfolio, and your ability to communicate.


Thanks,

Jon Kolko
Professor, Industrial and Interaction Design
Savannah College of Art and Design

taylorwelden notes,“So the final word is, as a private school, NASAD requires the entire school to follow it’s criteria.
38 programs following NASAD’s requirements is insane/extremely difficult/useless/expensive/time-consuming/requiring major changes/etc.”


Response: PLEASE SPARE ME THE BALONY! There are hundreds of schools with dozens of majors who have gotten SCAD accredited. Other than SCAD ,probably ever single major stand alone art school has it. Probably over 90%of the big, well-known universities with art schools have it such as UCLA, University of Cincinnati, Syracuse, most California State Univiersities with art program, etc. So, Please do say it is just too complicated!

Someone at another forum (collegeconfidential.com) in the art school forum noted that generally NASAD requires a minimum standard payout for professors that non- NASAD schools may not meet that minimum. If that is true, which I don’t know whether it is or isn’t, wouldn’t it make sense that the better and more well-know professors would go to the better paying, NASAD schools?

Also the post above by Jon Kolko, who is a professor at SCAD is just plainly wrong when he says<“Recently - at the last IDSA conference - they announced that they had changed their rules and NASAD accreditation was no longer required”

As post number one in this thread shows that what kolko said about IDSA and NASAD is a patent lie. IDSA still requires NASAD accreditation for schools to be listed on their site and uses NASAD for curriculum consulting, Per Leslie Kron of IDSA.

This is an issue that people care about!

Taxguy,

You still never answered my first question. What do you do and how are you such and expert on Art and Design schools and IDSA? It just seems a little strange to me that a new poster would come on here a try to start such a heated debate.

Also where did you go to school?

Oh by the way if you do your research you will find out that was written last year.

Yes, I am not an artist or in ID at all. In fact, I can’t even draw a straight line with a ruler. I do have a number of family members in design. My wife is a commercial interior designer who is published. My cousin is a well-known artist whose lithographs I have seen in many restaurants and my daughter is majoring in Digital Design at University of Cincinnati.

I, myself, am a writer.

Why am I making such as big deal? I believe that all prospects for schools who are spending a LOT of money should get as much accurate information as possible. People care!

I don’t mind anyone giving me their opinion on these boards. Heck your opinion and Taylor’s opinion on ID jobs probably exceeds any experience I could possibly have. If that was all that you did, I would have no problem. HOWEVER, when someone gives an opinion and then cites BOGUS facts to back up his/her claims, I get excited. It is wrong to influence people with patently wrong information. I want people to see both sides of an issue and to correct any blatantly wrong information.

Is that so wrong?

I am not saying that it is wrong my question is …What is your point?

The last post where this debate started was asking about the eduction at SCAD v/s getting a job and knowledge you need to be an Industrial Designer. My response to that is that SCAD has a top notch program regardless of NASAD. There have been plent of students that have graduated and landed great jobs at top notch companies. That being said I do not feel that a NASAD accredition really mattered.

What is your point?

Exactly? I’m really not sure whats being argued here. If you were simply trying to correct some information then thank you for the correction - but this should be closed because it seems to have turned into a bit of a sh!t storm.

What is your point?

Exactly? I’m really not sure whats being argued here. If you were simply trying to correct some information then thank you for the correction - but this should be closed because it seems to have turned into a bit of a sh!t storm.

Yep.




Response: PLEASE SPARE ME THE BALONY! There are hundreds of schools with dozens of majors who have gotten SCAD accredited. Other than SCAD ,probably ever single major stand alone art school has it. Probably over 90%of the big, well-known universities with art schools have it such as UCLA, University of Cincinnati, Syracuse, most California State Univiersities with art program, etc. So, Please do say it is just too complicated!

Re-Read the post.
This pertains to PRIVATE schools, as noted.
UCLA, UC, Syracuse, CSU… I am ‘90%’ sure these are PUBLIC schools. Come on, California State, it even has “State” in the name. We’re talking about a Private vs Public education, the inner workings of, and different systems both utilize.
You’re suggesting that NASAD will set up the guidelines for UCLA’s Industrial Design program as well as their Law School. No.



wouldn’t it make sense that the better and more well-know professors would go to the better paying, NASAD schools?

How much do SCAD professors make? What about RISD professors? UC professors? You have absolutely no idea. Next.



Also the post above by Jon Kolko, who is a professor at SCAD is just plainly wrong when he says<“Recently - at the last IDSA conference - they announced that they had changed their rules and NASAD accreditation was no longer required”

Admittedly, this is taken out of its appropriate/original context. “NASAD is no longer required to have IDSA recognition or chapters” would be a better way of stating this. The quoted statement just ends, clearly there is a greater point being stated in this quote.
Again, IDSA just held their Regional Conference at SCAD. Kind of an important event to be held at a non-NASAD university.
The suggestion of IDSA only recognizing NASAD schools is 100% false.



I’ve made my point, stated the facts and my opinions, as schooled and professional Industrial Designer.



We all know the facts. They’re all there.

NASAD means nothing to working Industrial Designers / graduates / elementary school kids / wives / nuns / cops / digital designers.



End.
Of.
Story.

Thank you. Now can this please be closed.

Taylor…I plan to ignore it and it will go a way. What do you think? Sound good?

Thank you. Now can this please be closed.

Taylor…I plan to ignore it and it will go a way. What do you think? Sound good?

Done and done.

The facts are above for anyone to read as reference.

Use the forum search function to search for other threads that can provide additional information on this topic.

I love being called a liar in a public forum.

agreed.
I had imagined your signature from the post-in-question (from over a year ago) that listed “Professor, Industrial and Interaction Design
Savannah College of Art and Design” should have been enough to credit your statements as a fact for any rational being.

perhaps others know better than an ex-SCAD professor and two SCAD alumni?


let’s grab a drink sometime here in town, sans NASAD discussions.

Well, Kolko, taylorWelden and Package ID and others: I wish you well. I hope you get to design some wonderful product that I will have the pleasure of using.

Peace to you all.:slight_smile: