Derailleur Sketches & Modeling

Hi All

I have been lurking on these forums for a while now and don’t know how I would have got through my last semester of uni without all the great submissions and feedback on this forum.
Thanks everyone.

Thought ppl might like to see my last semester’s submissions.
Would be great to get some feedback on the sketching.
I have just started printing them on an objet printer. :slight_smile:

Ok, I’ll go first. :slight_smile:

Great rendering. I thought it was a photo until I saw the exploded view.
So what’s new and great about this derailleur? What functional advances does this bring to the world of cycling?

As far as the sketching goes, it’s ok. I think more varied line weight and contrast would help a lot. For a heavily mechanical sketch, I’d also focus on one area at a time. So ghost out the majority of it and work a few variations of the arm for instance. Here’s a where a photocopier comes in handy.

It looks like you’re using a pen. Try a Blue Prismacolor pencil and a plug in pencil sharpener and keep it deadly sharp. You’ll be able to control your line weights better. ie super fine and light construction lines and bold dark definition lines. Or try a cheap Bic pen. With some practice you can get some semblance of varied line quality.

I think you’re ability is more than sufficient to communicate the idea. If anything, I would go to the point of saying that they’re over done.

Work on getting the same idea across, but taking 1/2 the time to do it…even 1/4 of the time.

I need a designer that can think with their pencil…not someone that can spend an hour polishing a turd (not saying this is a turd…just saying…oh, nevermind)…

This presentation shows me you can draw…I want to see if you can sketch and think.

As stated, awesome models.

I’d also like to say sketching this mechanically intensive type of product is not easy. Very difficult to take on, and it looks like you are designing every element, not just a pretty shell over the mechanicals. I love that you took that on.

I like to do the same thing as Brett with these projects, ghost out some of the more locked in mechanical parts, and then really bear down with some heavy contrast on a few of the elements I want you to focus on. Color can do the same thing. If the majority is just sketched in with line work and then a few parts are markered up, it really pops the sketch off and makes the design that much more readable.

In addition to the good comments above, try to resist putting tons of sketches onto a page that is set up for screen viewing (like this forum). I really can read any of you initial concept work. It is just simply too small. You did the work, show it. Do not hide it with a small scale.

Keep going!

As YO pointed out, a good solid underlay really helps with technical items. You appear to have a good handle on the 3D CAD, use that to your advantage in the sketching phase.

i’m no expert, but here goes,
quick coloring on mechanical subjects like these can be helpful:

  • to make your design/sketch more readable.

  • to sort of indicate materials/ components/finishes/textures (like on the 3d renders)

-to create more visual interest for the viewer.
important because your design needs to point to itself more than the other designers’.

a couple of markers would do the job, i’d say. :wink:

i love the models, top quality. and great that you took such a topic in the first place!
good going and good luck !!.. :smiley:

Fortunately the Large Hadron Collider is now active and running at 100% so we should be able to identify the particles, err, sketches on the top most panel. :slight_smile:

:smiley: :smiley: :smiley: :exclamation: :exclamation: :exclamation:

Hot stuff. Got a semi- just looking at the sketches.

As regards the comments above: yeah the thumbnails are kinda small, but the viewer can bear down and look if they want to. We encourage people to leave up all the thumbnails, since someone else might see something that you didn’t in an early sketch.

I like roller-ball pens and our sketch styles are similar, but I second the comment about making high-contrast areas.

I like the motif of the derailleur pulleys in the background, maybe that could be abstracted into some kind of background pattern? Or not…

Super cool. Send them to SRAM or Shimano or Campagnolo, see if they offer you a job.

as the others have said, nice drawings and renderings - I thought they were real too. The (engraved?) text really adds a lot

One thought, if your selling the design I didn’t really have a reference for what exactly was new… the arm part showed some development, but maybe that could be highlighted in context with the whole bike. It might reveal a little more about what it would look like if you saw it on the street or whether it was for racing bikes or urban hipster bikes or something else

nice work though. cheers!

I think everyone has covered the points for you to take a look at. Just wanted to say - Good Job

Omg thanks for all the replies and feedback!

Brett, the Dérailleur design has lower part numbers than the examples I pulled apart while learning how they worked. Only because shimano seems to use decorative elements in their designs to hide the fact that they are almost completely constructed from sheetmetal.
Also they allow parts to be replaced because they are screwed together rather than riveted like most of the current models. I know this increases manufacturing costs but I thought it would be a great selling point and extend the lifespan of the product.

I know exactly what you mean about the varied line weight and focus on specific areas. It was repeated on and so often as advice that i couldn’t forget it. Even when I knew I should stop and move on to another sketch or not finish the full view I found it hard to stop.
Its great that you noticed it, shows that I really do have to change it!

For those interested the front dérailleur was done with prismacolor verithins and then prismacolor premiums for thicker line weight, I just did the whole dérailleur rather than stopping when I should have.
The second was done with pilot hi-tec-c pens of different weights and a pilot G2 gel inc for the outlines.

Just before posting the images I recieved a box of Bic Cristal 1.6mm bold pens I ordered online as you cant get them in Perth WA anywhere. So I have been practicing with those and the 1.0mm medium and 0.7mm fine versions.

ipw, :slight_smile:
I know what you mean about polishing a turd, there were quite a few failed variations before these however.
That said turd polishing is surely not a bad skill to have in case I am in a bind and cant think of a great solution. :slight_smile:
Speed was one of the key considerations, I am not rapid enough yet, but it was def faster than producing all my variations and explorations in solidworks/photoshop.
I will try to show more variations in my next project.

Yo, Cheers, I did learn a lot about the mechanicals. Getting it to work in situ with a bike and the variations and limits needed was tedious to say the least. The assembly works in solidworks but I am yet to see it moving properly on an actual bike. I will def spend more time taking the 2d work further.
I have already started spending my nights at uni on their cintiqs and I have an large wacom at home.
I am so impressed with the work on I really want to pull my designs off the page the way he seems to.

And everyone else, thanks!
I will def try to get more development on the 2d side, add some color and show the designs integrated with their contexts although that might be tricky as my current project is a boat.
Also sorry to everyone that mentioned the size of the images. I put up those thumbnails quite small because I linked them to the full size a3 images. I guess that isn’t a convention, I will remember to mention it if I do it again.

For anyone still reading, sorry I know its a LONG post, I finally got my first part out of the printer.
Not perfect but its great to be able to hold something in my hand for the first time.
Btw I did it again so there is a large image linked to the thumbnail.

This is pretty much the most intelligent joke I’ve read on here. :wink:

Yes, I am glad to see that geeks truly do run amok on the Core77 boards :smiley:

The replaceable parts aspect, and the hard-edged form language, really recall for me the Paul’s Components derailleur of the mid 90’s:

Each part was replaceable, and the whole thing was super expensive at a time when nobody paid $150 for a rear derailleur. I never tried it, but it was said to feel like a straight razor, vs Shimano feeling like a super-cozy five blade razor with moisturizing gel.

Plus you can get rasta anodizing!

I thought it interesting that after the small CNC-based manufacturers started making a stir with the machined derailleurs, that Shimano changed up their aesthetic to be more hard-edged and machine-like. Was, and still is, good stuff.

The comment about showing the parts “in context” on a bike could be shown in sketches or some Photoslop over a hi-res photo of a road/mtb racer.

Nice render

I can’t help by being curious about the cog wheel or what you may call it… why did you go with 6 holes and not 5 like the sketch? They don’t seem to fill any function besides aesthetics, and 5 line up much better with the 10 cogs than 6… not saying 5 is the answer, just curious if it was an active decision?

I’ve actually always wondered about the composition/arrangement of several sketches. Are most of the really nicely composed/arranged sketches with multiple variations and views drawn in one take on one page as is or is it really multiple sketches on several pages that are digitally scanned and cut and pasted to form an arrangement that stands out.

I find that it’s quite difficult if you’re exploring and sketching loosely to actually arrange a page with multiple views and ideas into something coherent and that sticks out as well as communicates clearly without having to do a cut and paste from several different pages or a redraw of everything on one page from multiple pages.

Does that make sense?

nice catch on that detail engio.

Ditto on the difficulty compositing sketches on a single page.
However I think that my difficulty stems entirely from my inexperience before last semester I had never done any sketching at all and I still feel uncertain and hesitant when sketching.
I guess the issue is moot if you are sketching digitally.

I had to change the number of holes in the cog because of the space available.
When I sketched it it was a sleeve rotating around the bolt holding the cage together (similar to most dérailleur) but when i changed that to a ball bearing I had less space to play with and the 5 smaller holes looked a little empty.
I think you are right, 6 would have been a better number.

For those interested I have started a new project, this time I am designing something bigger, a boat :slight_smile: