lenovo = embarrassing

ah, you can see the construction a bit in the hinge area in this photo now that you mention it.

Ah interesting.
Is the Macbook air ( and other Macbooks) cast? I would have assumed it’s full CNC.
With their roundabout 30000 machines that would make sense.
We looked into casting but it has serious anodization challenges.

Finding myself in the tail end of a project that involves stamping a large part as well, I can attest to the cosmetic and ME challenges.
Also that there still is a good amount of CNC necessary to clean up and straighten out the part.

I haven’t looked at the Acer in person yet but from the hi-res images i can find online, I actually think it doesn’t look too bad.
The light anodization helps hide the stress lines put into the part through this aggressive process.
If this were anodized dark, I bet there would be an insane amount of defects visible.

At some point you gotta ask, is it worth manufacturing metal housing if you can’t achieve a quality standard set by Apple?
I would argue that there is a place for stamping, extrusion and other processes besides full CNC but you get into hot water when you are literally mimicking a product that is produced with “whatever the cost” kind of mentality and comparisons are inevitable.

Apple indeed CNCs most of their stuff as far as I know. Only Microsoft is powder injection molding it’s surface devices, similar to how high end DSLRs are made. I saw some of the WIP parts. It is pretty crazy, they are super light, thin and intricate and look JUST like a plastic part. Only the metal color gives away they are actually metal.

In the last few years Chinese manufacturers have really improved their metal game. Of course they stamp most of their parts, overmold them and CNC them a bit to make it look like an iphone. But the handfeel is remarkable. For just around $100 you get a device that feels very “iphoney”. But the stamped metal parts are usually just cosmetic and not part of the construction (which is the trick apple performs). They are mostly just cosmetic covers while the construction frame itself is built as cheap as possible, sometimes even just plastic. There are some interesting tests of these “pseudo metal” phones.
Check this out: Redmi Note 3 - Durability Video - Scratch, Burn, Bend Test - YouTube (bending starts around 3:00)
That thing snaps like a cracker!
It is basically the same with the cheap tablets and notebooks. The metal is only a cosmetic layer on top, construction-wise they are not comparable to an iPhone or Macbook at all.
But STILL it is getting better and better and they improve stability. Once they figure out how to use stamped metal parts as part of the actual construction we will all benefit from that.
I just would hope they would apply their developements without mimicing apple all the time, which is such a bummer. If they take that macbook clone, remove all the logos and give it a nice, matte black paint job I might be intrigued though :wink:

I get copying, but only from a “cover my ***” perspective.

  1. I create an innovative design that succeeds = everyone thinks I’m a genius
  2. I create a copy that succeeds = everyone thinks I’m a genius
  3. I create a copy that fails = everyone excuses it because the original did succeed, so how could I have known my copy would fail
  4. I create an innovative design that fails = I’m dangerously wasting company resources on vanity projects

For most managers, the downside of copying is so much better than the downside of being original that they will almost always go for the copy (ie “sure thing” in management talk). The real challenge in business is setting up an organization that accepts creativity when needed.

A great example of this is Chrysler buying AMC. AMC was a complete failure, but very creative. Lee Iaccoca later said that he bought AMC specifically for their development team in spite of their success rate. Chrysler promoted AMC’s head engineer to replace their own engineering department and establish AMC’s development process in Chrysler. That lead to 15 years of success and still influences Chrysler today.

That is what I always thought as well. It turns out it is due to the type of aluminum composition they use I believe. if they spec the right aluminum they can anodize it. I ended up doing that on a large part last year where machining was just not possible due to the size and the voids. We would have been machining away 90% of the material over a part that was rather large… after a bit of back and forth they figured out how to cast, post machine, and anodize it.

This is true. It’s totally possible.
We visited a few suppliers who are capable and are doing this in MP.

But it seems that they only way to really ensure consistent results and decent yield is to anodize black. So in terms of CMF pretty limited.
I believe GoPro is actually die-casting and anodizing (black) on some of their products.

What color was your part, Michael?
If you don’t mind me asking? :wink:

Of course, no problem. It was a clear anodize. It is on a huge speaker. There is a very very slight finish difference vs a second extruded, machined, and anodized part, but one is on the very top and the other is on the very bottom with 3 feet of black between them. We hide it as well by changing the surface finish. The cast part is bead blasted, the top is brushed with a machined in logo and chamfers.

Thanks Michael.
It sounds like you made all the right decisions for the process in order to get a good cosmetic performance.
Rougher textures certainly help.

My project will launch in September so we can pick this topic back up then :wink:

Something to remember with anodizing, in case you aren’t aware. The color is determined by the chemical make-up of the liquid in the tank, the time that it spends in the tank, and the alloy+heat treatment of the aluminum.

A 60 minute clear on 6063-T6 vs 5052 will be vastly different.

Some softer alloys 2000 and 3000 series, for example, can’t even come close to the same as what a 5000 or 6000 series alloy can, in terms of color. We tried dark bronze anodizing some soft alloy and the closest they could get was dark grey… Another challenge: welded aluminum. Welding adds heat, which alters the heat treatment, which alters the color. Sometimes it’s a neat result, but usually it’s just black or chalky white.

Now that we are completely off-topic, what is the surface finish of a part to be anodized? Polished? Sand blast?

I’m making a one-off bike stem and I will do the prep.

iab, to my knowledge, if it is a machined part, you should be able to ano any finish.

very true, in my experience I usually have to get 5+ variations on the finish to get to match a spec… more if I’m matching between different alloys.

this got WAAAY OT, but still interesting :slight_smile:

Well it was a revived 2012 post…

Part of the process is to etch the surface. However, it will show imperfections. Shot blasting might be a good fit, but you might want to run a sample first. Most everything I deal with that’s anodized has a brushed finish.

Also, don’t bright dip it. It won’t last outside.

Do you know the spec on the abrasive making it?

Neighborhood of a #4 finish in flat sheet finishing. I believe it ends with a 220 grit paper.

Fact is that everybody has his/her own experience and taste!
DiseaseDrugs

thanks for the fact Rony! :laughing:

I’m now craving some General Tso Chicken. :laughing: