Close
User avatar

sanjy009
full self-realization
full self-realization
 
Posts: 867
Joined: September 16th, 2009, 6:39 pm
Location: Adelaide, Australia
I wonder if the 'replica' Eames will fit into the back of my 'replica' BMW?

http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/art-and-design/replica-faces-famous-design-names-in-furniture-showdown-20110925-1kruq.html

IN WHAT may become a test case for intellectual property rights, the American design company Herman Miller is taking an Australian supplier of replica furniture to the Federal Court in a bid to stop it from using the famous Eames name.

The Australian furniture supplier Matt Blatt, with shops in Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane, sells replica designer furniture , generally at less than half the price of the real thing by legendary American designers, the late husband-and-wife Charles and Ray Eames.

But the American manufacturer Herman Miller, the owner of the Eames trademark, has had enough and is hauling Matt Blatt to the Federal Court of Australia, claiming that the Australian company has infringed trademark, contravened the Trades Practices Act and Australian Consumer Law, and is ''passing off'' furniture products as authentic items by Herman Miller.



On the Matt Blatt website under the heading "Replica Furniture":
http://www.mattblatt.com.au/Replica-Furniture.aspx?s16658

At Matt Blatt, we believe in selling quality replica furniture in order to make innovative, groundbreaking designs available to everyone. This philosophy has led to us developing a vast range of replica furniture that is stylish and affordable.

When did the definition of 'developing' change to 'buying from Alibaba.com'?


simon_four_fingers
full self-realization
full self-realization
 
Posts: 1027
Joined: February 26th, 2008, 12:19 pm
Location: Chicago, Il
At Matt Blatt, we believe in selling quality replica furniture in order to make innovative, groundbreaking designs available to everyone. This philosophy has led to us developing a vast range of replica furniture that is stylish and affordable.


In a twist of irony, a key point of modern furniture. Stylish and affordable to everyone......
summerdan wrote:At the famous designer's design, and see more of open the book thinking, read some books are always didn't harm
Come on I believe that you can

User avatar

yo
Administration
Administration
 
Posts: 16697
Joined: January 5th, 2004, 6:57 pm
Location: SoCal
word, Stephe


bcpid
step four
step four
 
Posts: 389
Joined: March 20th, 2004, 8:26 pm
If the manufacturing methods and QA are identical to the original product, it is authentic regardless of who slaps a label on it. If Herman Miller seriously expects to own IP on 50-60 year old designs, by dead designers, who designed those products to be affordable to the masses, they're effing delusional. That work is part of our culture at this point, and it's in the public domain and open for multiple manufacturers to competitively produce. As far as I'm concerned, knockoffs are the only way to go with Eames because they are the only Eames products that uphold that ethos. When HM decides to price their products competitively, then I will consider buying their version. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for designers' rights and all, but IP expires. It's like generics in pharma.

User avatar

rkuchinsky
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 5870
Joined: July 3rd, 2005, 9:20 am
Location: Toronto, Canada
Ip and all for me it's as simple as quality and value. Any repros ive seen are lower quality. Add that they have zero long term value it's a no brainer. A 30 year old Eames shell chair can get 300 easy a reproduction you'd be lucky to get $50.

Not all that looks the same is.

R
The Directive Collective
http://www.directivecollective.com

User avatar

sanjy009
full self-realization
full self-realization
 
Posts: 867
Joined: September 16th, 2009, 6:39 pm
Location: Adelaide, Australia
simon_four_fingers wrote:In a twist of irony, a key point of modern furniture. Stylish and affordable to everyone


Yes, but I don't think this is Matt Blatts motivation.

bcpid wrote:If the manufacturing methods and QA are identical to the original product, it is authentic regardless of who slaps a label on it. If Herman Miller seriously expects to own IP on 50-60 year old designs, by dead designers, who designed those products to be affordable to the masses, they're effing delusional. That work is part of our culture at this point, and it's in the public domain and open for multiple manufacturers to competitively produce.


I think the replica market is about appearance, not quality. I'm not sure on the Eames IP, and how it effects the trademark of the Eames name (which if the Eames designs are in the public domain, that is what Herman Miller is protecting), but Matt Blatt is pretty shameless on living designers and current work from the last decade:

Ross Lovegrove -Supernatural

Philippe Starck -Ghost

Patricia Urquiola -Frilly

rkuchinsky wrote:Ip and all for me it's as simple as quality and value. Any repros ive seen are lower quality. Add that they have zero long term value it's a no brainer. A 30 year old Eames shell chair can get 300 easy a reproduction you'd be lucky to get $50.


Yep. I dont know how much the Moroso Supernatural chair is (I think around $250), but to see it listed as a "cheap plastic chair...designed by Ross Lovegrove...$10-$30 f.o.b" on Alibaba.com, doesn't fill me with warm feelings of quality and value:
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/483979020/Plastic_Chair_Best_Price_FXD005.html

User avatar

Scott Bennett
full self-realization
full self-realization
 
Posts: 826
Joined: March 3rd, 2005, 5:39 pm
Location: Denver
That's probably pretty close to the FOB price on the "authentic" version too. If these guys didn't operate on 80% wholesale margins (!), they wouldn't have to fight off so many knockoffs.

User avatar

Azrehan
step four
step four
 
Posts: 343
Joined: April 25th, 2008, 7:05 am
Location: South Australia
sanjy009 wrote:simon_four_fingers wrote:
In a twist of irony, a key point of modern furniture. Stylish and affordable to everyone


Yes, but I don't think this is Matt Blatts motivation.


No matter what Matt Blatt and his contemporaries motivations are I think they are an essential part of the market. While I'd love an Eames recliner and a few Barcelona chairs in my study, I, and many others can't afford them so they either buy cheap made in china design knock off's or cheap made in china non-designer furniture.

I think if they are made to at least the quality of the furniture in the equivalent price range (e.g. Harvey Norman, Freedom in Australia) then there's no harm in it. A $1200 Eames recliner isn't going to stop me buying the real article for $8000 or $12,000 or whatever they charge. Sure it might look like a genuine, but unless people say it's a genuine Herman Miller and complain if it breaks, it's not damaging the brand. Also, those who can afford the Herman Miller versions (the bourgeois 5%) will continue to do so for the prestige of owning an "original".

Further to that, these designs should be made by the millions due to the intelligent use of materials. I'd rather see design knock off's being made than badly designed originals because they probably won't be on the side of the road as hard rubbish after they have gone out of fashion in 5 years.

User avatar

Lmo
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 3965
Joined: January 20th, 2004, 5:29 pm
Location: Pismo Beach, CA
Also, those who can afford the Herman Miller versions (the bourgeois 5%) will continue to do so for the prestige of owning an "original".


Aaron, I don't think "prestige" is the sole reason for buying an original, there must be an element of "pleasure" involved as well; something that answers an inner emotion. At least I hope there is.. ...

You have a new iXYZ phone ... Considering that it's going to be "on the side of the road as hard rubbish after they have gone out of fashion in 5 years" [more like 6-8 months], did you buy it so that your friends will see it and know you can afford the latest disposable technology, or did you buy it for it's necessity, features, form, etc.?
Lew Morris
"It's what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

New to the boards? Please read before you post ->Discussion Boards Posting Standards


Eddison
step four
step four
 
Posts: 206
Joined: October 4th, 2006, 12:36 pm
Location: San Francisco, CA
I have both clones and originals and enjoy both, but I will say that I handle/use the originals differently and have much more "pleasure" in using them because of the knowledge of their originality. As if somehow, my experience is (closest) what the designers intended even as the copies are well executed - sort of artist proof versus print, maybe? A bit nonsensical, yes. But as Chris Bangle once said (to the effect): "At the end of the day, when you're driving on the road, nobody cares what kind of car you're in but yourself."

...and I have found an original Herman Miller on the side of the road. 8)

User avatar

Azrehan
step four
step four
 
Posts: 343
Joined: April 25th, 2008, 7:05 am
Location: South Australia
Lmo wrote:
Also, those who can afford the Herman Miller versions (the bourgeois 5%) will continue to do so for the prestige of owning an "original".


Aaron, I don't think "prestige" is the sole reason for buying an original, there must be an element of "pleasure" involved as well; something that answers an inner emotion. At least I hope there is.. ...

You have a new iXYZ phone ... Considering that it's going to be "on the side of the road as hard rubbish after they have gone out of fashion in 5 years" [more like 6-8 months], did you buy it so that your friends will see it and know you can afford the latest disposable technology, or did you buy it for it's necessity, features, form, etc.?


My personal belief is that there are some people who own the top of the line for prestige and those who buy it because of quality and authenticity. It's the same reason some people go to restaurants which charge $7000 for a meal. It probably doesn't taste that much better than a $400 meal.

I own an iPhone 3Gs but before that had a phone that I made from my girlfriends old Motorola and a friend's of the same model with a cracked screen which I turned into one phone. The iPhone is my 3rd phone in 12 years and I've had it for about 2 years now. I'll keep it for another two, five or 10 if it lasts.

My point about the going out of fashion is that these designer knock off''s will probably survive longer than the furniture in the equivalent price bracket e.g. a cheap $1000 (usually pretty ugly) super padded couch, therefore it's better in my book and has a worthwhile place in the market.

User avatar

Lmo
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 3965
Joined: January 20th, 2004, 5:29 pm
Location: Pismo Beach, CA
point taken Aaron.
Lew Morris
"It's what you discover, after you know it all, that counts." _ John Wooden

New to the boards? Please read before you post ->Discussion Boards Posting Standards

User avatar

sanjy009
full self-realization
full self-realization
 
Posts: 867
Joined: September 16th, 2009, 6:39 pm
Location: Adelaide, Australia
My issue with the replicas isn't the price, or who makes it, or the quality. It's how someone is making a fast and dodgy buck by taking advantage of a designers work.

It's one issue if an object is in the public domain, and someone makes a shite version of it, but still plasters the designers name all over it. I don't like it but it not illegal. At least the opportunity exists for someone to make a quality version of it.

It's another issue if a designer gets ripped off, with no compensation, and has their name linked to a shoddy product, that they have no control over.

User avatar

sanjy009
full self-realization
full self-realization
 
Posts: 867
Joined: September 16th, 2009, 6:39 pm
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Herman Miller wins the case:

http://www.indesignlive.com/articles/in-review/Win-for-Herman-Miller-vs-Matt-Blatt#axzz1cxp5D0u4

But it's not about copies themselves, just using a trademarked name on replicas without stating they are copies.

http://www.mattblatt.com.au/ now has this on the front page:

NOTE: Matt Blatt's replica products are not manufactured or approved by, or affiliated with, the original designers, manufacturers or distributors including Herman Miller, Charles or Ray Eames, Knoll, Fritz Hansen, Flos, Studio Italia, Giogali, Artemide Spa, Tolix or Xavier Pauchard.


and every product has the disclaimer 'replica' multiple times.


Return to furniture