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Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby Travisimo » June 28th, 2010, 11:08 am

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Your sketch is very clear and helpful, but maybe if one of the 3d houses that are churning out this kind of animation might show it even more clearly...

It'd be good for the general public to understand the concept, good PR for the animation house, and maybe it would get another idea out there and gaining momentum




Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby mgnt8 » June 28th, 2010, 1:15 pm


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Maybe we need to shift focus on the cleanup

$10 mil X Prize for ideas to clean up the gulf

http://tedxoilspill.com/

This will be a special prize, not exactly like the others we give," Beland said. "We will be asking people to submit ideas and (crowdsourcing) solutions." Before leaving the stage, Beland urged entrepreneurs to submit their ideas to him personally, at francis@xprize.org

Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby Lmo » June 28th, 2010, 1:29 pm

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If TED can't successfully promote this, what other group possibly could?
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Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby d3raymond » June 28th, 2010, 7:05 pm

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I've forwarded links and attachments on to Francis Beland < francis@xprize.org > who has in turn responded;

The X PRIZE Foundation is currently in the process of developing a multi-million dollar competition to help alleviate the effects of the BP oil spill in the Gulf. This competition aims to incentivize and recognize the development of rapidly-deployable methods to clean-up crude oil along our coastlines and within our oceans. We will announce further details on the development of this competition in the weeks to come on our website (www.xprize.org <http://www.xprize.org> ). Thank you for your encouragement and support!

And, then I watched the last few hours of the TEDxOilSpill, . . . on www.livestream.com/tedxoilspill/
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Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby NURB » July 2nd, 2010, 12:30 pm

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This is the kind of thing that makes me want to punch someone at BP. I've now officially joined boycotting everything BP including poor mom and pop BP stations. I said it was bad before, but now I don't care.

http://www.fastcompany.com/1660006/like-the-onion-except-disgusting-bp-prs-reports-from-the-gulf
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Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby Lmo » July 2nd, 2010, 1:03 pm

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This is incredibly hard to get my head around; ultra-high explosives are actually being considered as a feasible solution to this fiasco.

We might as well begin to consider what it would take to hang booms across the Strait of Florida and between Cancun and Cuba.

I fear I will not live long enough to see the Gulf again as it was... Image
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Up to now, the strategy has been to "capture" oil gushing from the damaged riser pipe, thereby allowing a majority of the oil being pumped into the Gulf to escape into the environment. At no time was an effort put forth to "prevent" the oil from escaping the rising pipe. Considering that two additional wells are being drilled into the same reserve, it seemed to me that the best strategy would be to halt the gush of oil from the damaged riser and resume pumping oil to the surface when the new drills were installed.

I've attached a really simple illustration of a possible solution to blocking the oil leak (rather than continuing to capture oil from the leak) until a new well is tapped.
Sandbag.jpg
Sandbag.jpg (123.13 KiB) Viewed 1349 times


As an aside, I found it interesting that the U.S Federal Government is treating the disaster as a "business opportunity." For more information on how you (Mr. Corporation) can benefit from the disaster, visit the following link: https://www.fbo.gov/spg/DHS/USCG/USCGRD ... sting.html

A few more disasters and the economy should recover nicely!

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Inspired-
Pressure within the riser is 6.5 tons per square inch, . . . We're going to need alot more sand.
Or a way to concentrate the available weight more effectively.
Seawater weighs 64# per cubic foot, Sand weighs between 80-125# per cubic foot, (depending on granularity and other characteristics) resulting in a net weight per cubic foot of submerged sand between 16# to 60# per cubic foot.

Scott Henderson and I filed a White Paper with the USCG last Friday, . . . So far, we've only received an confirmation number on a concept for oil containment.

Perhaps we could pile up the 112,000 submissions made so far into a single massive well-designed plug-capture-containment form to stop the leak, . . . possibly as effective as what BP is capable of accomplishing.
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...more expansion on the "oil tube" idea... Just adding in the idea that the tube's diameter could be huge-- a football field's length in diameter. The extra room around the contained oil flow inside the tube is the sea water, which would equalize against pressure outside the tube. The only thing new here is showing that the tube's diamter could be massive to counter against the presure and expanding gasses within the tube.
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It is looking like this might be finally coming to an end.

http://www.grist.org/article/2010-07-12 ... -gulf-oil/

I was watching a show on Discovery last night....it brought me even further into the realm of believing that this is something that should be left to the experts. Maybe, just maybe one of the ideas on here could solve the problem, most of it is just navel gazing.

The following image came to mind while watching the show:

Imagine, riding your unicycle at night in the middle of winter and a massive storm is kicking up. It is freezing cold, dark out, and the fire hydrant across the street is gushing water. If you don't stop it, it is going to flood the whole street eventually damaging everyone's house on the block.

Unfortunately, you can't get off your unicycle because of your undying fear of stepping on a crack and breaking your mother's back. You also can't leave your yard because you told your Mom you wouldn't and you're a good kid.

You figure you have to come up with a way to stop this. Strangely enough you have 500 drinking straws in your pocket and the remote control for your ROV with 5 axis gripping claw (you live in your mother's basement, of course you have an ROV).

Maybe everyone here can finish the story...because, effectively, this is what the engineers in the gulf have been facing.

Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby Travisimo » July 13th, 2010, 3:46 pm

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a little off subject, but shows the otherworldy challenges of those depths... ROV videos of sea animals around the deep ocean wells.

amazing.




Re: BP Oil Leak: Ready, Set...Brainstorm!

Postby d3raymond » July 15th, 2010, 6:55 am

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Well, it appears this morning as though the experts that started this disaster are still far from controlling it. Possible damage to the integrity of the casing due to mud over-pressure early in the game. Valves that will not operate, BOP's that were inoperative, . . . The experts are trying for a high-pressure solution as that approach is consistent with the options in their play-book.

The concept of a high-volume low-pressure containment is feasible. The structure is comparable to a mile-deep "boom" that contains all flow from the riser within a vertical column. It's very crude "plumbing" but it's workable and will be effective in containing the flow. The physics are inarguable. The flow and pressures involved would test any pressurized system which is the solution consistent with oil industry thinking; Hard pipe, bolted flanges, valves, remote gauges and sensors, . . . all designed to work at depths of 5,000' under normally anticipated conditions.

What was not expected was the extremely high pressure of the flow at 13,000 psi, and the high proportional volume of methane and natural gas at upwards of 30% as opposed to anticipated volumes of 5%, resulting in 250 X expansion rates.

It's relatively easy to get your head around the physics involved; depth, flow, volume, buoyancy. It's horribly difficult to overcome the mindset of professionals riding around on their unicycles who perceive an abnormal set of conditions to be resolved with off-the-shelf solutions. Their tool-set, - and thinking -, is limited to the equipment at hand.

When you only have a hammer, all of your problems have the tendency to look like nails.

New thinking is required.
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read somthing today that implies they are close to solving it:

From MSN this morning:

"The cap is a stopgap measure designed to keep the oil in the well or funnel it to ships until the relief well is done. It is considered the best hope yet of stopping the crude from streaming into the water for the first time since the April 20 explosion on the Deepwater Horizon rig that killed 11 people.

The process of activating the new cap began with BP shutting off pipes that were funneling some of the oil to ships on the surface so the full force of the gusher went up into the new cap.

Then deep-sea robots began slowly closing, one at a time, three openings in the cap that let oil pass through. Ultimately, officials hope to block the flow of crude entirely"

Their new cap seems most similar to this concept from our brainstorming exercise:
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and the winning design came from........................ a plumber....gee guess real hands on experiance matters not just pie in the sky fairy dust imagining has value.

Berkeley prof: ‘Mystery plumber’ may have designed the new BP containment cap

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_upshot/20 ... inment-cap

ea passed the plumber's sketches on to a contact at the Coast Guard, and to a panel of experts who were evaluating proposed schemes to repair the leak submitted by the general public. Jonsson writes that when Bea first got a glimpse of the containment cap that has stopped the flow of oil into the Gulf, he noticed striking similarities to the designs dreamed up by the plumber.

"The idea was using the top flange on the blowout preventer as an attachment point and then employing an internal seal against that flange surface," Bea told Jonsson. "You can kind of see how a plumber thinks this way. That's how they have to plumb homes for sewage."

BP spokesman Mark Salt told Jonsson that he presently has "no way of finding out" if the well-capping crew used any of the mystery plumber's ideas. Salt added that there's "a good chance that this was already being designed" when Bea handed over the sketches.

Still, there's one way that BP's containment officials can be sure if they followed the plumber's blueprint: When he submits his three-figure-an-hour bill.

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