Will shoes ever be made in America?

You never know what is going to come back, look at American Apparel. I think it would be fine to have more manufacturing in the states. Manufacturing diversification and knowledge base are generally a positive economic attribute. Yes, our lost infrastructure is a problem. If we had (or when we have) to pay the true cost of industries that have so fully externalized some of their cost structure we may find it makes sense to manufacture them closer to the point of use. My 0.02.

There is at least one company making shoes in America:

Like them or not, some Crocs are Made in USA:
http://www.crocs.com/company/investor/
Great analysis of New Balance and “Made in America”:

For ‘Made in America’ the “all or virtually all” rule applies, and US content must be disclosed for automotive, textile, wool and fur industries:
http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/madeusa.htm

New Balance has 3 factories in Maine and 2 in Massachusetts, including one that is connected to their R&D offices in Lawrence. Up until the 1990’s, New Balance was a fairly small volume shoe company that made a majority of their shoes in the US. Then all of a sudden their shoes became extremely popular and their sales grew something like 600-800% in a matter of a few years. I’m sure we can all understand that the reality of the situation required them to look to Asia to support the demand. It is very difficult to produce shoes in the US, and it’s not just labor costs. Materials are more expensive here and they are more limited than what is available in Asia, so maybe we could give them some credit for producing at least some of their shoes here. It’s that much more than any other major company produces here. Some of you make it sound like some big scam, when really they just outgrew themselves.

Fair enough, but much of the comments /links on this thread are regarding advertising or labelling that implies something that isn’t entirely true - the consumer thinks that the whole product is made in the USA, when it isn’t.

This kicked off over ten years ago…

Technical sneakers (i.e. compression moulded eva runners and the like) were invented in Japan (Mizuno, Asics Tiger etc) …and originally produced in South Korea, so they’ve never really had the technology outside of Asia, or bothered to import the machinery to the Western World to manufacture them. It’s not viable to inject outsoles in the West or close the uppers, it never has been, the skills have always been in SE Asia, they have not been moved there.

Me? I don’t really give a toss where the shoes are made - the NB Chinese factories are superb. But I feel that the consumer should be given a mrore truthful picture, in order to make a better informed decision. It’s not just sneakers, so many Italian companies stitch their uppers in Albania. I feel that there is even more dishonesty when we get to the luxury goods market.

I think you mean that there is nobody outside of Asia who can do it as well as Asia does it currently. There are still people who can do it very well outside of Asia, but they are few, far between and ridiculously expensive…and they usually will give you a bit of stick about it while they are doing it as well.

But the idea that Asia invented it and got to where it was without help is false.

But that version is an Interesting story.

I’ll tell it to my Uncle-in-Law who spent nearly 40 years cutting sewing, lasting and closing full grain boots at Red Wing Shoes. Started hauling hides and eventually ended up as a leather pattern maker/cutter. Just before his retirement, he consulted with–ie: taught–Korean, Taiwanese and Hong Kong Chinese pattern makers on how to do his job. He also cleaned up and updated their production lines in Korea and Taiwan with surplus machines from a company based in Lawrence Massachusetts in order for them to build shoes more effiecently.

I’m sure he’d get a real kick out of it considering he still bitter about the whole thing.

I think you mean that there is nobody outside of Asia who can do it as well as Asia does it currently. There are still people who can do it very well outside of Asia, but they are few, far between and ridiculously expensive…and they usually will give you a bit of stick about it while they are doing it as well.

No not at all - I was speaking specifically about technical running shoes (the kind New Balance, Asics and Mizuno still make), nothing else, there were running shoes before then (Fosters i.e. Reebok) for instance, but they were basic and had more in common with dress shoes. It took the Japanese to refine it and develop it.


But the idea that Asia invented it and got to where it was without help is false.

Asia (as in the Japanese) developed and defined the technical running shoe, yes.

But that version is an Interesting story.

It’s a story I’ve read in several books and also seen at a museum in Japan. Mizuno has been around since 1906; Asics Tiger 1949

I’ll tell it to my Uncle-in-Law who spent nearly 40 years cutting sewing, lasting and closing full grain boots at Red Wing Shoes. Started hauling hides and eventually ended up as a leather pattern maker/cutter. Just before his retirement, he consulted with–ie: taught–Korean, Taiwanese and Hong Kong Chinese pattern makers on how to do his job. He also cleaned up and updated their production lines in Korea and Taiwan with surplus machines from a company based in Lawrence Massachusetts in order for them to build shoes more effiecently.

That’s shoe making in general that you are talking about.

In this case you are talking about USA product that has been outsourced to Asia but was originally made in the USA. I was talking about technical running shoes specifically. The kind that the Japanese brands make - they were never moved to SE Asia because they’ve always been there!

Edited to add: where d’you think Nike got the idea from?

http://www.sneakerset.com/sneakerpedia/nike/

What technology do you refer to that Asia developed and refined without help or without a foreign influence?

You are referring to the OA manufacturing technique and technical aspect of mass manufacturing a shoe and not the technology and specific processes that make up manufacturing. Asia did get the initial manufacturing techniques from somewhere else. They then improved the process of manufacturing, as typically happens; but they did not create it.

New to the footwear industry and learning about the challenges of making shoes in the US. Would it ever be possible to portion off the manufacturing process so that the soles were developed and produced in Asia and then the rest of the shoe was produced domestically (stitching/putting it all together)? Is that possible from a manufacturing standpoint? Talking about a cupsole design with a 2 piece canvas upper and a vulcanized rubber sole. Thanks!

I’m not a shoe guy, but I think New Balance does this. Footwear guys please correct me if I am wrong.

Making an outsole in Asia and stitching the uppers in the USA would be exactly the opposite of what they would do. Clicking and closing is labor intensive so that would happen in asia. Making the outsole depending on what type of shoe it is could be done here but usually also done there especially when it’s vulcanized. That’s all in Asia now I believe.

I think this is how NB does a portion of one of their models. It is a heritage model that never changes. I believe the materials are all cut in Asia, and then shipped and assembled.

Shoenista,

Do you know more about the practices of the english shoemakers?

Grenson for example. I hear they do all their uppers in India now without exception and finish them in England and can still put made in england on them.

Thanks for the info. Even if you could find a factory to cut materials in Asia, I imagine setting up the system for a small brand to assemble in the US would be difficult.

And for what benefit?

R

I just found this article online. It appears that Keen kind of, and really do mean kind of, assembles shoes here in the states.

There is however some fine print.The uppers of the shoes are still currently sewn in Asia. the “Built in America” part is the injection moulding of the sole and bonding it to the upper. It’s not an ideal solution but it is a start.

Link to the article:

I don’t know anyone who works at Grenson, so I cannot answer that. Grenson aren’t that high priced, though. The leather will have to come from abroad as there aren’t so many tanneries left. There are quite a few uk shoe makers and factories still going (thriving infact) .

I know these guys Shoe Construction

These creepers are still made in the uk - with the genuine (really heavy) crepe soles (i.e not the Chinese tr copies that TUK does) http://www.underground-england.co.uk/creepers.html

I get all of my lasts and heels developed here. http://www.springline.net/ It’s great because I can get things exactly how I want and measured and checked by a footwear technologist before I send it abroad. Almost everything else has to be imported.

This is a good resource because you can hire time in their workshop in order to make shoes. They sell quite a lot of components - and soling leather etc. http://jtbatchelor.co.uk/

Gina is about five minutes walk away from my home in Tottenham
http://www.gina.com/product-index.aspx

Here’s a bit about the factory here Savannah Miller - Twenty8Twelve Gina shoes | British Vogue | British Vogue

This factory is a few miles away, still in North London http://www.fabulouslyfetish.co.uk/ Thriving and can’t make enough (so he tells me!). Quite a few UK shoe factories had to adapt to survive, so the UK has become the place for fetish and transvestite footwear and there was even a movie called Kinky Boots Kinky Boots (2005) - IMDb

We’ve always had a history of shoe making in the UK Midlands and the capital - the footwear schools and some of the suppliers and factories just about keep it going and there will always be quite a number of small workshops with hand making as it’s not difficult to get training.

I was in a Chinese factory that makes some New Balance about a decade ago. They indicated to some outsoles that were being shipped abroad to NB Factories, so I’d say, yes.

I have to eat my words a little bit about NB in the UK - they do click and close the uppers there.

Re outsole moulding - we don’t have any of the sophisticated type of outsole injecting machines in the UK, so it would make sense to inject them in China and ship them.

But you cannot ‘make’ vulcanised outsoles and ship them to another country. It doesn’t make sense. You need to construct the uppers in the same place as the soles. Only the outsole bottom is moulded. You then cut strips on rubber (called foxing), assemble the shoe -lasted upper, outsole and wrap the foxing around and then you bake the whole thing in an oven (the vulcanising process), which sets the rubber and outsole and upper into a shoe.

Kinky Boots

An absolutely great flick!

If you really want to have a product made in the USA and keep down costs, you could always take advantage of the world’s largest slave labour force and have the manufacturing done inside prisons. I believe this is where all registration/licence plates and a number of other items are currently manufactured.

you could always take advantage of the world’s largest slave labour force and have the manufacturing done inside prisons.

First, the definition of SLAVE;

  1. a person held in servitude as the chattel (movable property) of another
  2. one that is completely subservient to a dominating influence

Prisoners in the United States are not forced to labor, nor are they completely subservient to anyone. They are free to exercise the day away, read, watch television, play cards or damned near anything they want, for as long as they like, packing away three squares a day the whole time. If they are exemplary in their behavior, they may be given the opportunity to work in various shops to acquire job skills that may allow them to find employment “outside”.

The State of Oregon Oregons Correction Enterprise’s Fulfillment Center is an impressive example, in my opinion, of how “correction” should work. The Prison Blues work clothes line has found a worldwide market. They also manufacture, heavy equipment components, park & recreational equipment, office furniture, etc.

Hardly “slave” labor. Requirements of Admission and Remuneration.