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Postby SindriP » March 5th, 2007, 10:55 pm


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As i wrote earlier today over at Kicksguide, awesome job. But I know you're not posting this here to bolster your ego, so here are my two krone's.

Before I checked out your complete project over here, my first thought was that this was a team based shoe. However, after viewing the whole thing I realized it was very "Air Jordan" in terms of performance being put first. I agree with Ade's comment about the shoe lacking a certain "oomph" to a certain extent, however, I really like how you combined the helicopters sharp horizontal line and the anatomical lines in the midsole, visually it looks terrific. Those kind of subtle details really make me appreciate a shoe, and I'm a big fan of minimally designed shoes (Air Pippen II being my all time favorite), but I feel there has to be something that catches you from a distance.

I read somewhere that in order to create a succesful shoe, you have to:
1. Catch the customer from a distance, make the shoe distinct somehow, so he'll want to pick it up.
2. When viewed from up close he should notice the details and quality manufacturing.
3. Delivering performance and comfort when tried on.

(something like this, does anyone remember something along these lines being posted?)

You're right there, some minor tweekings or making something pop out should do the trick.

Your sketches explain your thought process really well, and illustrate that this project was not at all about painting a pretty picture.

All the tech stuff, amazing, nothing to add. Beautiful illustrations, the butterfly, dope! I really admire how you go into details about the materials used, I remember a certain someone that worked for Fila before moving some place else always going into detail about material use.

One other thing that I would look into, before you put this in your portfolio, is refining the graphic design part of your presentation, in terms of narrowing your font selection down to two maybe and deciding where to use underlines or bold. What I'm talking about is most apparent on your two inspiration sheets, you've got serif fonts in the body and some sort of pixelled font as headings that don't appear anywhere else. Looking at some of those things would really make your presentation seem as more of a whole. A good thing to do would be to sit down a divide your text into three or four groups or so. One group of main headings, second of under headings, then perhaps two groups of text bodies, depending on how technical and thorough it is. One other thing is the framing of your images, the rounded edges look good and relate to the project, but on some places you have sharp edges on your frames, is there a reason for this? I think sticking to the rounded ones would be the way to go. Line thickness as well, they seem to vary somewhat on borders. But overall, you've got some great graphics that really complement your design, I just think it's a matter of simplifying them a bit.

I think that pretty much sums it up, like I said earlier over on KG, I'm really being picky here and I think this is one of the strongest and most thorough concepts posted by any of us that frequent these boards. Thanks for sharing Tony.

kind regards, Sindri

Postby VD23 » March 5th, 2007, 11:43 pm


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Sindri: Thanks for that critique!

Just what the doctor ordered. I agree with you on pretty much everything. Granted, my graphic design is pretty weak because, well, I don't know a damn thing about graphic design! LOL. I basically go "that looks cool" and move on. I figure the focus is the shoe in the end, so I try not to spend too much time on that type of stuff...though apparently I should. Thanks for the wake up call.

Has anybody noticed the similarity between the retractable missles on the Comanche (frontal view) and the way the Molded malleolus in the sock sticks out from the cutaway in the upper? Thought that was cool... :p

Thanks again to all who put in their 2~

-TH

Postby bohrdom » March 6th, 2007, 4:39 am


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that is a sick, sick concept. great job! i just read your story on kicksguide and it mentioned that you did some freelance stuff for jordan? what kind of stuff did you do there?

anyway, could you explain in detail this resin transfer molding? i'd like to know more about this process.
also, how does that fit mechanism work in making sure there isn't too much restrictive force on the foot? you mentioned that it works like a seatbelt, so i'm assuming that there is a locking mechanism on sudden, jerky movements, correct? but how does this work for the length of the person's running stride and movements in basketball? i.e. would i feel a irregular or continuously oscillating sense of restrictive force while i play? also, how does it limit the degree of lockdown?
sorry for nitpicking, but the pictures are kinda small for me to mke out.

Postby montecusna » March 6th, 2007, 9:38 am

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Amazing work!
Only little hints.

1) No need to have a midsole like look. You don't have a normal upper, so what about a regionalized midsole and outsole that better mimic the cushioning technology and give some futuristic look that will make the shoe shine?

2) As Denis Dekovic said once, jumpman logo on an "AIR JORDAN" shoe should be in an unexpected position.
Shoe should be an "AIR JORDAN" and you may look around just to confirm that...oh yeah, the logo is here!

3) Toebox, I would like to stay away from past incarnations...I know what Michael Jordan says, but when Tinker Hatfield "Da Vinci" came in with some very cool variation (XI), Michael didn't have nothing to say...be smart on that!

4) Take advantage from all the technology you put inside this shoe, show little hints of that. I know it's very very difficult to keep it simple and clean at the same time!!!! ... making it too simple could result in a more generic look. Tough balance!

Since, like you, I've tried to design AJ's a lot of times, I admire your effort because you went very deep on that! My advice could be just to remix a bit the aestical stuff to make it more in tune with great researches and technology you have put into this concept. Just this.

Ciaooo
MC [pietro]

ps: loving the italian renaissance inspirations!!!

Postby VD23 » March 6th, 2007, 12:21 pm


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Thanks guys!

These critiques are really great. I actually anticipated most of these responses whie designing.

Bohrdom: I freelanced for JB for all of 2004. It was just conceptual sketching and my ideas came out on products like the AJ XXI, XXI PE and B 2'rue. I sketched on other projects as well, but nothing that ended up on shelves. It was definitely a great learning experience for me and a dream come true to work on this type of stuff.

Yes, I suppose I need to explain the advanced resin transfer molding a bit. I learned about this process while researching the development of the Comanche, which was supposed to be the best Military helicopter ever developed. After years and billions of dollars spent, the project was actually terminated, but some great things developed for it.

Advanced resin transfer molding is an epoxy impregnated fabric, so it is basically like carbon fiber in a 3D mold. The fiber lines the mold and is then injected with a resin that solidifies it. The strength/durometer can be fine-tuned based on the braid of the fabric. This process was used to replace parts on the comanche to reduce weight by 30% over carbon fiber. This is why you see this feature very prominent on the shoe. This chassis provides a single solution for breathability (at the heel), stability, and flexibility while remaining light weight. It serves as a heel counter, lateral stabilizer/support structure, shank AND the last of the shoe. It is curved at the side to cup the foot when making hard cuts and I put the anatomical foot map detail on it to call out it's anatomical purposes. This ARTM process is also used for making golf clubs and intricately molded medical equipment.

As far as the fit mechanism, the idea was to have the shoe FEEL llke a sock, or not wearing a shoe really. So it hugs the foot, but is restrictive when needed. Now, I am no engineer, but this would require a LOT of studies on neccessary forces on the foot during play, etc. The winding spring inside the unit would determine the force applied during a relaxed or running state...but I could not get specific on it since it is only a concept. I wanted something that looked and functioned very simply, but was very technical underneath...much like an engine under the hood of a car. I added the compression sleeve over the top to protect everything, make the shoe sleeker/more aerodynamic and to make the foot feel supported. I chose to go with a zip-up construction since it has never been successfully used on an AJ....mostly because it looks cheesey...which is why I covered it up with a protective and flexible molded piece.

Hope this helps!

-TH

Postby VD23 » March 6th, 2007, 12:33 pm


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Pietro!

How are you man! Damn, you are ONE TOUGH CUSTOMER! LOL

Hopefully my previous post answered some of your questions. The midsole is actually inside the shoe attached to the sock and fits into the ARTM chassis internally.But I see what you mean.

I did a lot of wrestling with the logo and originally had a XXIV where the jumpman is. However, there are several Jordans (VII, IX, XI,XIV, XIV, XVII, XIX) that do have a jumpman logo on the lateral side. I decided to keep it small, but go with it. It's tough to find an unexpected place after 22 existing models...LOL

The toe box was tough too. I wanted to keep the jordan Language and familiarity, but add a twist to it. If you check out the specs, the toe box is actually a high polished malleable TPU so it stretches less and does not crease. Later I thought of doing a mutli-layerd mesh toe to make it really wild...but I decided it would throw off the balance of the shoe a bit due to the compression sleeve being fabric.

As far as showing the tech...I feel what you are saying, but ultimately the fit system was very busy and would be a bit scary to the consumer I think. So I decided to hide it away completely and let the shoe perform without them having to worry about neccessarily "how". I decided to make the ARTM piece my focus since it was doing so many jobs and introducing something new as well.

Thanks for the input, all!

Postby montecusna » March 6th, 2007, 12:58 pm

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VD23 wrote: Damn, you are ONE TOUGH CUSTOMER!


HAHAHA...I have to be a tough customer...these babies usually cost around 180 euros and I still can't afford too much of them!!!

...anyway I was just trowing some idea to make the design less linear. Midsole is hidden, but it looks like you have a normal midsole, which is the one thing I think dosn't have to happen (just my idea...).

The concept is beatiful and I might consider in spending these 200 bucks!

...I'm fine thanks, hope you will have some free time next month to play basketball because i'd need an opinion about some equipment (which is not a new type of microfibre ball... ;))...but only if you are a size 11 or 12...

Ciaoooo
Pietro

Postby VD23 » March 6th, 2007, 9:28 pm


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Here is a larger view with the correct heel. The first version has the upper fabric I wanted, but this is more correct with a cleaner fabric.

Image

The outsole was where the Leonardo inspiration came in. He was the first man to study flight in depth, and more importantly HUMAN FLIGHT. I noticed that many of his works contained angels...the personification of human flight. I wanted the articulated forefoot to flex in all directions naturally, but also look like an angels wings when MJ flew over his defenders.

Also, Leo wrote backwards and was left-handed. His phrase "Volo strumentale" means human flight. If you look closely, the zipper cover tab on the left foot (page 1 butterfly details) says volo strumentale backwards. Here, on the right shoe it says Jordan. Just a few tidbits for you on how the inspiration played a part in the design.

-TH
Last edited by VD23 on March 6th, 2007, 9:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Postby VD23 » March 6th, 2007, 9:34 pm


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This went through a lot of evolution along the way. Here are some older versions:

This seemed too much like the XIX so I scrapped it:

Image

I found this pic of a wolf when I was looking for Airwolf helicopter pics (incidentally, the font I wound up using is from Airwolf) and thought it looked like MJ when he was staring Magic down as he was defending him in the finals. Intelligent and focused... So I had developed the logo to look like a wolf's eye. In the end, It just didn't feel right and I thought the jewel might peel away from the sock:

Image

an older version where the sleeve was angled forward. I wanted t to look different than the other J's in this respect...but it felt anatomically incorrect to my eye. This is also the version with the XXIV logo at the ankle:

Image

Postby archeever » March 8th, 2007, 3:09 am

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Very awesome T. Its very concise and just tons of nice details. I like how deep you went with this and the visual story you told.

As for suggestions, I feel the toe might be a little too clean. You could try adding one row of coffers/ventilation portals to the toe cap. This could possibly add a little more flexibility and ventilation.

Postby ScriptD » March 9th, 2007, 12:21 pm


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I think I am understanding the assembly of the shoe, but the way it is presented seems to be in a confusing order or layout. Maybe if you organized it in a more straightforward manner there would be less confusing. The obvious way would be in a more similar order to an exploded view.

When you first posted it was like an inspirational slap in the face. You really have shown how deep you can go in the design of footwear, from inspirations to research to tech detailing. I also really enjoy reading all of the feedback that you have gotten because it lets you know that revision can be endless also. Once you have a killer presentation like you have created, you can always revisit parts of it and try to make it pop even more. Great work!

Postby VD23 » March 9th, 2007, 8:32 pm


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Script: Sorry for the confusion. Communicating this stuff in a more organized manner is DEFINITELY an area I need to improve in! And yes, you can never please veryone and revisions are endless.

Arch- Thanks bro! Nice to see you checking this board out-hope all is well with you!

-TH

Re: Air Jordan XXIV concept

Postby Janice1989 » January 6th, 2015, 8:45 am


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I would like to know if the Jordan 24 will be released?

Re: Air Jordan XXIV concept

Postby Traveler9 » January 20th, 2015, 12:23 pm

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Janice, do you mean RE-released as a retro?

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