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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby AndyMc » June 21st, 2016, 7:00 pm

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iab wrote:What's with the chain routing to above the seat stay?


Their rear suspension design with the high rear pivot causes a lot of slack in the chain as the shock compresses if it's routed traditionally. They added a pulley to the front triangle to keep tension.

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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby Sunny_45 » August 30th, 2016, 1:58 am


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Cool stuff, Though some road bikes are impressive for new user. You can find some new bikes from http://cyclingninja.com/best-7-beach-cr ... s-reviews/ Hope you will find the best road bike from there.

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby jcharles00 » August 30th, 2016, 10:53 am

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When I was out in San Diego I saw a number of these Diamond frames. I guess an evolved take on the trek Y frame? Not sure if there's any real benefit to the form.. I'd imagine any weight lost from seat stay delete got rolled back into the top and down tubes.
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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby iab » August 30th, 2016, 1:32 pm


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Actually, the Trek y-foil and the Diamond would likely be more aero than a traditional diamond frame. Even an "aero" version of a diamond frame. I like the "Diamond" brand on a y-foil design, quite ironic.

But the UCI (governing body of bike races) doesn't like anything other than the diamond frame. It could be a tradition thing, it could be an aesthetic thing. Either way, the UCI is not having it.

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby slippyfish » August 30th, 2016, 2:09 pm

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There's some aero benefit to getting rid of the seat tube although there is now nothing to shield the rear wheel. Plus the boundary layer of air moving forward off the rotating rear wheel creates some aero 'churn'. However the main reason why beam bikes (see Softride) have been popular for triathletes is the suspension effect of the seat beam saving the back and legs of the athlete for the run...friends who have done several full length IM's say its all about saving it for the last five miles of the marathon leg.
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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby yo » August 30th, 2016, 6:24 pm

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also, it looks cool as fuk!

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby jcharles00 » August 30th, 2016, 6:58 pm

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iab wrote:But the UCI (governing body of bike races) doesn't like anything other than the diamond frame. It could be a tradition thing, it could be an aesthetic thing. Either way, the UCI is not having it.


yeah. fortunately, the popularity of triathlon is allowing some of the weird back into cycling where the UCI doesn't care to look. :)

I always wonder about the real cause of the UCI restrictions. It seemed pretty suspicious when they screwed around Obree back in the 90's.

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby iab » August 31st, 2016, 7:43 am


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jcharles00 wrote:yeah. fortunately, the popularity of triathlon is allowing some of the weird back into cycling where the UCI doesn't care to look. :)

I always wonder about the real cause of the UCI restrictions. It seemed pretty suspicious when they screwed around Obree back in the 90's.


I kind of agree with them is the sense it should be about the athlete and not the bike. Since a bicycle is such a simple mechanism, it is easy to compare yesterday's with today's greats. The three major differences are road conditions, training methods and aero. Obree happened to be at a time of transition and as a designer you know, people hate change.

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby jcharles00 » August 31st, 2016, 10:41 am

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iab wrote:I kind of agree with them is the sense it should be about the athlete and not the bike. Since a bicycle is such a simple mechanism, it is easy to compare yesterday's with today's greats. The three major differences are road conditions, training methods and aero. Obree happened to be at a time of transition and as a designer you know, people hate change.


I suppose I could understand that argument. It would be fun if there was 1 equipment set that all participants had to use. Kind of like when they run Eddie Merckx races at the track - steel frame, toe cages, etc. I'd still like to see a super-modified class too, with the bleeding edge tech.

Here's another one, maybe on the more common side of high-end. Moving aero flaps on the head tube and electronic shifting are both oddly UCI legal. haha.
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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby iab » August 31st, 2016, 11:29 am


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jcharles00 wrote:Here's another one, maybe on the more common side of high-end. Moving aero flaps on the head tube and electronic shifting are both oddly UCI legal. haha.


Ya. UCI seems to be selective on which they do and don't accept, especially when it comes to aero. I guess the y-foil was too early and they were still in the "I hate change" mode.

But they certainly relaxed the hour record rules, mostly rider position.

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby jcharles00 » September 7th, 2016, 9:01 am

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Here's another interesting one.. concept bike going the route of integrated everything. Reminds me of the Rael concept that Evan Solida did some years ago. The disc caliper fairings are kind of novel.

more details here http://www.bikerumor.com/2016/09/04/eb1 ... rag-check/
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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby iab » September 7th, 2016, 10:20 am


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I like it. Thanks for posting. The fore and aft seatpost dampening is pretty cool.

But call me a curmudgeon, I have yet to see a compelling reason for disc brakes on a road bike. Even when wet, I can lock a wheel with traditional calipers. And maybe I'm not a princess, but I can't feel any different modulation capabilities with disc over traditional. This bike seems to be going into convulsions trying to make a disc aero when Taurus had internal routing (with rod brakes no less) and "aero" calipers (rear is tucked under chain stay) since 1919.

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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby jcharles00 » September 7th, 2016, 10:33 am

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iab wrote:But call me a curmudgeon, I have yet to see a compelling reason for disc brakes on a road bike.


I tend to agree. My experience has been that discs require less frequent cleaning and adjustment than rim brakes, but I know people who've had the opposite experience. Overall, I think the marketing point of stopping power is pretty bogus. The real weak point (if you want to call it that) in bicycle braking is the interface between the tire and the road, not the frame and the wheel. You can skid with a rim brake pretty easily. I guess for folks with carbon rims, discs might be nice for reducing brake fade and wear on an already not-great braking situation.

Re: Bike Spotting

Postby slippyfish » September 7th, 2016, 11:29 am

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jcharles00 wrote:
iab wrote:But call me a curmudgeon, I have yet to see a compelling reason for disc brakes on a road bike.


I tend to agree. My experience has been that discs require less frequent cleaning and adjustment than rim brakes, but I know people who've had the opposite experience. Overall, I think the marketing point of stopping power is pretty bogus. The real weak point (if you want to call it that) in bicycle braking is the interface between the tire and the road, not the frame and the wheel. You can skid with a rim brake pretty easily. I guess for folks with carbon rims, discs might be nice for reducing brake fade and wear on an already not-great braking situation.


There's also the notion that the braking surface on your $2000+ wheelset could wear out with a season or two of hard use, whereas replacing a rotor and pads is a standard operation that will allow you to keep your fancy hoops. Agreed on the contact patch between 25c tire and asphalt being the weak link though. I have $100K of surgery to confirm that. :(
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Re: Bike Spotting

Postby mbC » September 7th, 2016, 1:11 pm


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iab wrote:...But call me a curmudgeon, I have yet to see a compelling reason for disc brakes on a road bike. Even when wet, I can lock a wheel with traditional calipers. And maybe I'm not a princess, but I can't feel any different modulation capabilities with disc over traditional.


slippyfish wrote: Overall, I think the marketing point of stopping power is pretty bogus.


I think that the thing that is often missed in the discussions (but not by 1ab) re: discs is modulation. I'm not aware of anyone in the industry touting increased power- it's discs' modulation and consistency that are the key draws, driven in part to the often terrifying braking performance of carbon fiber rims in the wet. As cable routing has become more convoluted (for aesthetic and aerodynamic reasons), cable drag becomes more and more of a factor- and it's something that sneaks up on you.

While I've never had trouble with decent quality rim brakes pulled by fresh, good-quality cables/housing against aluminum rims in reasonable conditions, start to mess with any one of those conditions and things can degrade slowly (cable & housing contamination) or less so (carbon in the rain). Faster? Maybe. More confident? Absolutely. And the thinking among many in the industry is that the wider tires they allow (~30c for a road bike) can be faster than the high-pressure 23s we've all been riding for ages.

I'm no fanboy -given the choice between wide tubeless tires at low pressures with rim brakes or 23c tires at 120psi and disc brakes I'd choose the former every time- but having ridden with discs for nearly fifteen years off road and on the road for about one, I appreciate the consistency and control that they provide. While they're no reason to pasture a favorite bike, I see little reason to buy a new road bike without discs.

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