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Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Zachary_Fitean » June 19th, 2017, 4:44 pm


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thanks for the feedback
Last edited by Zachary_Fitean on June 20th, 2017, 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby tommyle » June 19th, 2017, 5:08 pm


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Not a bike seat expert but it seems a bit sharp overall?
Especially from the top view.
I understand the portion you actually sit on is curved/ more ergonomic,, that should translate across the whole design.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby FH13 » June 19th, 2017, 5:23 pm


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Not much to critique there. As an industrial designer you need to educate and convince the viewer why it is a good design.

a) there are no ideation sketches so no way of knowing why you chose that final direction
b) no materials or call outs. Is it a cast iron seat?
c) no mood boards that guide your design direction
d) no research explaining what's wrong with the dozens if not hundreds of saddles out there.
e) how is the saddle made. I don't see any fasteners or believable assembly methods

Why would I want something angular and sharp in between my legs??????

Nice graphics and renderings but unfortunately there are a lot of portfolio's out there with those.

Please show your thought process and really think about the whys & hows instead of the "final" "finished" rendering.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Zachary_Fitean » June 19th, 2017, 5:30 pm


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FH13 wrote:Not much to critique there. As an industrial designer you need to educate and convince the viewer why it is a good design.

a) there are no ideation sketches so no way of knowing why you chose that final direction
b) no materials or call outs. Is it a cast iron seat?
c) no mood boards that guide your design direction
d) no research explaining what's wrong with the dozens if not hundreds of saddles out there.
e) how is the saddle made. I don't see any fasteners or believable assembly methods

Why would I want something angular and sharp in between my legs??????

Nice graphics and renderings but unfortunately there are a lot of portfolio's out there with those.

Please show your thought process and really think about the whys & hows instead of the "final" "finished" rendering.


Agreed, all of this is in the process of being put together, was just looking for feedback on what is currently shown. Maybe just got a little too ahead of myself.

Thanks!

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Cyberdemon » June 19th, 2017, 7:59 pm

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This hurts my taint just thinking about it.

In addition to echoing all the previous comments - this seems to have a fundamental disregard for human anatomy, materials, manufacturing, and basic cycling or bike construction.

You literally have a sharp edge where my ass goes.

Why does it appear to be made from a 2mm wall of solid plastic? How does it attach to the seat post? How is it adjusted? Why have a flat area in the back if my ass is so far forward? Since when are aerodynamics a problem in a bicycle seat, and what analysis have you done that actually makes this more aerodynamic other than some arrows you drew?

You have nice renderings...but nice renderings masking a design that is either so fundamentally advanced I can't possibly fathom how amazing it is, or a design so fundamentally flawed you skipped over the parts of the design process that were important to jump to the 3D renderings.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Nap » June 19th, 2017, 9:13 pm


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Really nice graphics, congrats. As FH13 mentioned, where is the thought process? (for our understanding, and the clients understanding as well) Personally I think your concept as one major flaw, it's a concept. A bottom view of the seat with the "dummy" cyclist, can you do that?

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby yo » June 19th, 2017, 10:56 pm

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I recommend posting the images into the forum instead of a link to a google drive doc.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Zachary_Fitean » June 19th, 2017, 11:38 pm


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Cyberdemon wrote:This hurts my taint just thinking about it.

In addition to echoing all the previous comments - this seems to have a fundamental disregard for human anatomy, materials, manufacturing, and basic cycling or bike construction.

You literally have a sharp edge where my ass goes.

Why does it appear to be made from a 2mm wall of solid plastic? How does it attach to the seat post? How is it adjusted? Why have a flat area in the back if my ass is so far forward? Since when are aerodynamics a problem in a bicycle seat, and what analysis have you done that actually makes this more aerodynamic other than some arrows you drew?

You have nice renderings...but nice renderings masking a design that is either so fundamentally advanced I can't possibly fathom how amazing it is, or a design so fundamentally flawed you skipped over the parts of the design process that were important to jump to the 3D renderings.


Wow, I didn't realize a concept could upset somebody so much? haha. It was conceptual, I wasn't claiming this to be more or less aerodynamic or better or worse than current seat designs, I was just trying to illustrate why certain design choices were made in order to maintain air flow being that the shape would definitely cut the air worse that a typical seat. Now if a seat will actually affect aero dynamic's enough on a bike to actually affect a competitor would be another story. But it would lead back to me saying it's just conceptual.

This project was just about exploring forms for me. I was using theory rather than facts, motorcycle seat are shaped similarly and I was applying that theory to bike seats, in a what if scenario. Being that this was just a portfolio piece, I thought it would be a cool project to explore something that doesn't typically change too often and a good way to show my technical abilities.

Maybe that was the wrong thought for me to have... by the way pretty close on the 2 mm, its 3mm haha

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Zachary_Fitean » June 19th, 2017, 11:40 pm


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Nap wrote: A bottom view of the seat with the "dummy" cyclist, can you do that?


Don't quite understand what your asking to see, can you explain?

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Nap » June 20th, 2017, 5:57 am


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Wow, I didn't realize a concept could upset somebody so much? haha. It was conceptual, I wasn't claiming this to be more or less aerodynamic or better or worse than current seat designs, I was just trying to illustrate why certain design choices were made in order to maintain air flow being that the shape would definitely cut the air worse that a typical seat. Now if a seat will actually affect aero dynamic's enough on a bike to actually affect a competitor would be another story. But it would lead back to me saying it's just conceptual.

This project was just about exploring forms for me. I was using theory rather than facts, motorcycle seat are shaped similarly and I was applying that theory to bike seats, in a what if scenario. Being that this was just a portfolio piece, I thought it would be a cool project to explore something that doesn't typically change too often and a good way to show my technical abilities.


When you design a chair you assume it's a object for people to seat, right? A chair also might be a installation, right? Which one is yours? A story/ title, for your consideration, http://hahamag.com/paris-deflates-mccarthys-called-christmas-tree-installation-cause-looks-like/

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby iab » June 20th, 2017, 7:46 am


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I rarely, rarely offer critiques to things posted on these boards. I see concepts here that defy the laws of physics, but I let it go. But I am a bike guy.

You pretty much hit on the head my largest criticism of ID. Your drawing is absolutely worthless other than being a pretty picture. You are competing with Dogs Playing Poker. You obviously never actually did even the roughest proof of principle prototype, or any competitive research. If you had, you would have found the ideal contact for a seat is the sit bones (go ahead, google that).

Your single (why on earth would you do only 1 idea) concept has the sit bones on a downward angle, you will always be sliding forward on your saddle. Curving a seat to follow the contours of an ass shows a completed lack of knowledge of how a saddle works. You have a raised section in the middle of the seat? wtf? Cyberdemon said it all with that "feature". I have no idea why you have that rearward flat section. To add weight? And there are rules to the position of the seat to the seat post if you want to race on your saddle.

All in all, a massive functional fail.

As for the form and renderings. Seems rudimentary to me, but you could be in your first year of school, so I can't say that is a bad thing.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Cyberdemon » June 20th, 2017, 8:23 am

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I was purposely being harsh because like iab I'm a bike guy.

To say that you want to demonstrate your technical abilities, but without showcasing your skills as a designer (problem solving, ideation, testing) is worthless. And I'm being harsh because if this were a portfolio piece being presented to me as a hiring manager I would ask "what were you thinking?"

I would rather see 10 crude foam models that you whittled away at your desk, cobbled together with play-do, or sketched with crayons in your portfolio than a super-spiffy rendering of a polished form that defies all logic of design, ergonomics, engineering, etc. The important takeaway here is that every piece in your portfolio should do a job of telling a story about you being a well rounded, thoughtful designer that can identify and solve problems. Every 2nd year student these days can bang out some basic forms in SW and jazz them up in Keyshot. Doesn't matter if it were a bike seat, a chair, a hand trowel, water bottle, etc.

You mentioned you were using theory and motorcycle seats for inspiration. If you've ever seen anyone ride a motorcycle you'd see the flat part of a motorcycle seat is for the passenger, not the rider.

You also didn't say "this is just a speed form exercise" you said "Being that I've been immersed in it, it makes sense to me" - if you were immersed in this for more than a day it means that whatever development work you did leading up to it was too inspired by form and not inspired at all by design. Which makes it art, not ID.

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby Nap » June 20th, 2017, 9:08 am


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Something similar, Eric Barone's DESCENT ONLY/ NO PEDDLING record holder bicycle,

Image

Re: Bike saddle Re-imagined

Postby FH13 » June 20th, 2017, 11:56 am


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Zachary,
If you want to showcase your rendering skills then present it as such. But if you present it in a "full project" format it will be evaluated as such.
Also, please don't resort back to saying "it was just conceptual". That's a very common response when students are faced with criticism. It's like asking the viewer to ignore 90% of the work and give feedback on only 10%. It will also not produce any useful feedback from the viewer or of your work.
If you want to explore angular shapes then choose a non ergonomic product (space ships, toasters, speakers, top housing of a drill, etc,)

Hope the comments helped.


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